Advanced Spell – Body of Light

Honestly, while creative I consider it broken.

“For the remainder of the scene, no attacks except those by undead, spirits, infernals, or entropic creatures can strike you, and against those you gain AR 2. You cannot move while formed of a body of light, as your feet cannot gain purchase on the inanimate floor beneath you. ”

Too many ways for this to be abused. Barring an official ruling to permit it, I would ban it from any table I ran and argue against allowing it if not the GM. The ability to make yourself untouchable in combat while allowing for continued spellcasting means every combat is an auto-success given sufficient time.

There’s also the issue that you’re changing a summoning of power (light) into a transformation effect which I’m not sold on from a metaphysical perspective either.

Full marks for creativity though.

With a sweep of his hat,

Paul

I agree that the spell has some problematic features, though I am also not 100% convinced that the ‘Gladius of Light’ component would affect the entire body. A possible solution would be to have it only affect the hands.

I understand that unarmed combat could technically permit the use of other body parts, but the line would have to be drawn somewhere…unless you consider your left buttocks to be a weapon, of course

I agree that the spell has some problematic features, though I am also not 100% convinced that the ‘Gladius of Light’ component would affect the entire body. A possible solution would be to have it only affect the hands.

I understand that unarmed combat could technically permit the use of other body parts, but the line would have to be drawn somewhere…unless you consider your left buttocks to be a weapon, of course

Accept that you are combining it with body of the warrior which infuses your muscles and gives you natural AR2 – even on your buttocks. So Body of the Warrior does effect your entire body, not just your hands, thus by the rules I think this would effect your entire body.

If you did just have it effect the hands, than obviously there is no purpose in having the combination spell.

This one was crunched out last year:
viewtopic.php?f=56&t=1690

I brought up the idea in that thread, but it wasn’t dealt with. That thread mainly dealt with combining gladius of light with other attack spells, and I don’t think it necessarily resolved those either. Looking at it I guess I did kind of make a mistake in just discounting the damage from the Body of the Warrior, because in a combined spell you might have been able to get both damage dies combined.

But that wasn’t really the point of this thread, which was to discuss how the application of the rules appear to make the caster effectively incorporeal to many monsters using this advanced spell.

As a judge I wouldn’t accept TooDeep’s interpretation (barring an official response). Generally the weirder the combo is, the less consistency you are going to get from different judges interpretations. This one is weird.

Here is how I’d roll:

Your unarmed attacks now only affect “the impure” and do the superior damage of the GoL. If you punch something else (malfelen, gnome robber, Val mastermind, random dog…) your strikes pass through them doing no damage.

Your body gets AR.

You get to keep moving normally.

If you are not using your hands to attack, you can still manipulate an object. Including wielding a weapon/shield.

For me the ambiguous corner case is what happens if you are grappling something the hands would damage. Technically the spell doesn’t really address that point mechanically and I am resistant to permitting broken or bent combinations. But the fluff is compelling to me. So…Personally, as a judge, I’d let you spend a fate point to do the impossible and effectively grant yourself the quality of an energy aura as GoL, but only against things that are grappling you or striking you with natural weapons.

I think that’s how I’d handle it.

If you combined these two spells, you get the effect of body of warrior and create a gladius (weapon) of light. You get no weapon tricks with the created weapon. If you want to manifest it as a pike or a big, glowing fist…fine. But the effect is the same.

There is nothing to suggest in combining these spells that you suddenly become immune to attacks from creatures. Even if there was…think of the abuse potential. I cast this spell, then full-on tackle and “attack” that wall over there (my body being the weapon). Oh…it isn’t one of the specified creatures? I pass through harmlessly….call me Kitty Pryde.

I wouldn’t say there is nothing to suggest it. The Gladius of Light spell indicates it is insubstantial to everything except certain types of creatures. The combined spell effects your body, and the rules say that special effects like that from one spell apply to both, so logically it should have that effect on your body. I didn’t come up with that take of the spell without reason.

That said, I agree on the potential for abuse. The exact abuse you mentioned was why I mentioned the recipient must be immobile. After all, if you aren’t, once you go through that wall, how do you stop? Sounds like a great way to lose your character.

I don’t disagree with your ruling either, as it is practical. But I will ask, shouldn’t the glow or weapon potentially overlap your natural attacks (hands) to allow for a d4 (might) +d6 (primary) damage attack against the special creatures (d8 in the case of entropic) that does not ignore AR? (based off the rules)? and be harmless against anything else? Like it would for any advanced spell to allow the stacking of the damage of the two spells?

From a conceptual perspective ignoring mechanics for the moment, I still have a hard time meshing these two base spells. The Gladius of Light “brings forth” the weapon. Whether you want to call it a summoning or manifestation of will it is external to the character. It’s effect is inherent in the fact that the power has been focused at a point (the weapon) to generate the desired effect.

Body of the Warrior very specifically internalizes the manifested power, toughening the skin and hardening the body to grant the extra damage. If the two are combined then logically the gladius of light effect becomes a layer on top of the body of warrior effect. The result of that would be to sheath the character in a golden nimbus of light.

While an impressive visual effect, I think it would lose it’s most potent punch. If you stab someone with the gladius of light and the blade ignores the defenses of the creature, it will bite deep. Striking with a hand that’s coated in a very thin layer of the power means that the light might not even get through the being’s armor or clothing before the hand underneath encounters the creatures substantial defenses. The spell wouldn’t fundamentally change the nature of the person given the layering affect as noted above, so it’s not like the light punches a hole in the defenses for the fist to follow.

To me this feels like the more correct approach. Especially given that the Body of the Warrior spell doesn’t create a weapon, it simply strengthens the body to be more effective.

In terms of the damage, following the logic presented, my inclination would be to say that the non GoL damage would be assessed first against the creatures defenses for physical creatures so d4 (Mi) vs. AR. IF it would bypass, then the strike sufficiently penetrated to do damage and the secondary GoL effect would also count. If the physical strike did nothing, then neither would the GoL effect. For incorporeal creatures, the physical strike would pass harmlessly through it, so only the GoL damage would apply.

While a “realistic” interpretation from a rules perspective, it’s also complicated and more confusing. It raises questions about what happens if you have a way to affect spirits physically, and then you’ve got to reassess as well.

I think for a home campaign you could find an explanation and balance that the GM and the player could agree on. Within the realm of the shared LoA campaign, I would be inclined to say this is a spell combination that’s better avoided.

This thread has encouraged me to go back and review my Dark Blade of Illir (Twilight’s Blade) spell to bring it in line with the current Errata. Very situational, but could still be fun.

As I mentioned the first time, I think it’s a creative idea. In a home game I think this has more potential than in LoA.

If Matt doesn’t have any objections to my interpretation about the complex interaction of damage and creatures I’d allow it at my table. Your mileage may vary from GM to GM though and would be worth checking in advance. The other thing I would note is that being sheathed in a brilliant golden light is impressive and is likely to garner a lot of attention. Still, if you’re short a torch….

With a sweep of his hat,

Paul