About the val’Holryn Family

When at “The Wedding”, I didn’t know about all that extra backstory as to why there was an illegitimate child and the politics was in progress.

“Interesting.”
‘Hiro’ Barbara Duran-Dellanov, Legion of Heaven’s Blade (retired), assistant to the val’Dellanov family at “The Wedding”.

Also, as a side note: while working on my character (a val’Holryn, obviously) I was looking at the Reluctant No More Bloodline Talent, and it made me wonder: did the val’Holryn get affected by The Storm?

There is no mention of the val’Holryn in either The Storm or The Aftermath.On the contrary. In the old yahoo group I certainly asked about this since my 3E character (sir Jaeger val Holryn) was both of the val’Tensen powers and a paladin of Hurrian to boot. Henry answered that Jaeger and other val Holryns did not have the same response as the val Tensen and were otherwise fine.

So. . . They weren’t affected by The Storm, but yet they gained the Reluctant No More Talent? Strange. Something we’ll have to look into later.

Ah well, as far as the mechanics of Bloodlines go, that change/update happened between editions as I remember…

Since the val’Holryn manifest whatever the family’s bloodlines powers are, in the new edition they now get the “updated” val’Tensen powers. Should they instead use the old set of powers? An interesting idea. Even if a story purist would say yes, as a practically I don’t think you want to “waste” the space in your core rule book explaining a corner case of val’Holryn unaffected by the Storm and listing alternative val’Tensen powers.

Maybe I’m wrong to dismiss it. Maybe there is more here to think about.

I think clear answers on this could be very interesting. Perhaps the most fundamental question is what generates a Bloodline / set of Bloodline abilities? There are val associated with gods that have no Valinor that have bloodlines and bloodline abilities. Even for the gods that do have Valinor there’s no indication of which or how many Valinor (if any) were involved in a Bloodline’s founding. We know the essence of a single Valinor is at least sufficient to found a minor bloodline (Serenity of Beltine and the val’Sosi). The death of a Valinor can have some effect (val’Sosi and possibly val’Tensen).

When the Serenity of Beltine died the val’Sosi were born, but no val’Ishi suffered ill effect. That implies at least that the Serenity wasn’t involved in the founding of the val’Sheem bloodline or that the loss at least didn’t take away from her descendants. The val’Tensen moved from having the Bloodline power of the Reluctance to the Bloodline power of the Wrath. Having the power disappear would imply that the Reluctance of Hurrian was involved in the founding of the val’Tensens and that the Serenity of Beltine was not involved in the founding of the val’Ishi. The Wrath arguably then was part of the founding of the val’Tensen bloodline as well, if suppressed by the Reluctance preventing those bloodline abilities from manifesting.

If the val’Holryn copy the abilities of a given bloodline when the val’Holryn’s born or at least their first power manifests then I would expect none of those would be impacted by The Storm. Do we know how young that manifests? That would make them an offline not live system. It would be interesting to know if the val’Holryn first started exclusively manifesting the Wrath’s bloodline powers after The Storm, or how that worked. If there’s a change after The Storm at all, what’s the master copy that’s getting updated that the val’Holryn draw on if those who had the Reluctance ability before and after The Storm weren’t impacted?

According to the Player’s Guide to Arcanis, the bloodline powers represent the divine influence granted by each patron deity to their bloodline. If the val’Holryn’s abilities aren’t directly granted, what does it mean for them to be able to manifest any of the others family powers at all? Why do the other families not view the abilities as stolen? Were the val’Holryn an experiment to help boost the numbers of each of the families or preserve their legacy against possible annihilation?

I think it’s all tied up in what makes the val’Holryn as unique as they are. Whatever that is.

With a sweep of his hat,

Paul

In The Black Book of Ymandragore, the page in question now in possession of the val’Sosi family, it details how the Sorcerer King vivisected a Valinor (possibly a Valinor of Sarish) and transplanted an organ into himself, granting him unimaginable power. Perhaps there is a similar organ that does the same in Val.

Nope – that’s not what happened.

I meant to circle back to bloodlines earlier.

The idea of bloodlines drifting over time has more examples than just the val Tensen. The val Abebi presumably had a different bloodline power than the one that currently lets them create Blastpowder. Since Blastpowder has only been “a thing” since they asked Altheres for their Second Git. What was it before? Presumably you could find out if you looked deeply into the val’Abebi mentagi …. perhaps the val’Holryn’s too. After thinking about it I now believe it’s possible for bloodline powers to drift over time if the appropriate source “Takes Actions” that tinker with it.

Sources. I’ve seen three things over all the years playing Arcanis that have bloodlines: vals, Elorii, and some certed darkkin who are the spawn of major “Infernal Lords.” That leads me to believe that you need a really powerful extraplanar creature in the roots of your family tree. (Celestial, Elemental or Infernal). The magical powers on tap come from not being 100% mortal (well, the elorii aren’t 100% mortal just being elorii, but you know what I mean…). For all we know other really powerful entities could also have the potential to create magical bloodlines. Jeggal Sag and the other “spirit” powers of shamans seem like they would likely make the cut…JS could take on multiple Valinor so obviously it’s not an issue of power. But to date we haven’t seen any example of this…except possibly for *that one weird encounter* with a Larissian Oracle in the over the counter module In the Shadow of the Devil. There a Human seemed to have an encounter with a spirit or divine entity and became a val in the middle of soirée…

It might also be interesting to note that in the 3E days of Arcanis that all sorcerers needed to have a “spark” that came from a divine, elemental or infernal source. If this is still so, then it seems like there is a distant “connection” between bloodline powers and the ability to wield arcane magic. It would suggest that in the roots of any sorcerers family there was a powerful extraplanar being and that some of the sorcerer’s ancestors may have had bloodlines…if indeed the sorcerers doesn’t have bloodline abilities too in addition to their arcane magic.

Thank you for the contribution val’Holryn. I wonder why people don’t hate the val’Holryn family for breaking their monopolies on rare goods, like Ansharan Portals and Blast Powder. The val’Holryn do have access to Ss’ressen eggs, and while obviously a smaller supply, they could start selling their own. And with the Ansharan Portals, the val’Inares have fallen out of favor with others for moving into Abessios, so they would be more than happy to find an alternative.

…granting him unimaginable power.

It didn’t. In fact, it had no effect on the Sorcerer-King whatsoever and was discarded.

Which makes one wonder.

If it had no effect on the SK, then why did Lucius Orata go to such trouble to have the same thing done to him?

Oh wow, that was shocking. Well, the Heroes walked away from the ordeal with a new Bloodline, so I won’t blame the S.K for not trying. Maybe the Valinor must willingly grant their blessing, or maybe the S.K was already so inhumanly powerful that the bonus power had no effect. We do have evidence (not conclusive, considering it’s from Loshnek), stating that he and the Master missed him dearly. He might actually be a Fallen Valinor, and couldn’t “double up” on divine power. All conjecture for now.