Makers of Award-winning Role Playing Games › Forums › Arcanis: The Shattered Empires › Harvesters Internal › Character options
- This topic has 37 replies, 5 voices, and was last updated 12 years, 1 month ago by Anonymous.
- AuthorPosts
- March 13, 2014 at 4:42 pm #258852AnonymousInactive
At which point? By the end of character generation? Plenty of Martial/Arcane/Divine characters could get 3 ranks in both a combat and arcanum by the end of character generation with the right race/background choices.
That is the main reason I don’t see the point of the whole “Experts are the only ones who can cast and combat well at the same time so they are too powerful!” decrees.
JohnThe difference between an Expert getting 3 ranks a tier in Melee and Arcanum and a Martial doing it is the talents they get as they advance. Getting 2 skill talents vs getting 2 Martial and 2 Maneuvers or 2 Arcanum/Devout. That’s the big difference here.
I don’t think that an expert who Cast and Combats is too powerful, and I’m not saying that the other archtypes shouldn’t get the chance to do it, I just think it should cost them more than a single talent. I’m one of the people who thinks the current Training Talents for it are too costly, but a single talent that simple adds it to your advancement options is not costly enough.
March 13, 2014 at 4:53 pm #258859AnonymousInactiveYou’ve confused me
![\":)\"](\"{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_e_smile.gif\" "\\"Smile\\"")
I’m sorry but I’m not sure what you are arguing for or against.John
March 13, 2014 at 5:03 pm #258866AnonymousInactiveIt’s not that I don’t think Martial/Divine/Arcane shouldn’t be able to get 3 ranks Arcanum and Melee/Ranged.
I just think “Fixed” Continued Training was too powerful, because you literally got to do it at the cost of one talent. One talent with no drawback whatsoever. One talent made you an expert with better talent selection. Why play and Expert? Yes, there will still be a few players who play an Expert because they have a slightly better skill selection than a M/D/A with “Fixed” Continued Training, or for story reasons. But most people will dump Expert like a bad girlfriend. That’s why I out cried even after the errata on Continued Training.
Do I have an answer? No. Sword and Spell and etc are bad. Continued Training is too good. I proposed that you had to take the talent each tier. I feel a talent that grants you a rank in Arcanum if you are martial that you can take each tier isn’t a bad talent. It would let you play catch up as you see fit.
March 13, 2014 at 5:08 pm #258868AnonymousInactiveGot it! I love my Expert and I don’t think I’d trade out if the Continued Training came back as discussed. I *do* think an Expert level Talent is required to balance it out and I’ve given my thoughts on how it should work. Do you think that would help with your concern?
Arcane/Divine/Martial get a dip into the Expert’s skill advantage but Experts get a dip into one of other archetype’s Talent advantage?
March 13, 2014 at 5:14 pm #258873AnonymousInactiveGot it! I love my Expert and I don’t think I’d trade out if the Continued Training came back as discussed. I *do* think an Expert level Talent is required to balance it out and I’ve given my thoughts on how it should work. Do you think that would help with your concern?
Arcane/Divine/Martial get a dip into the Expert’s skill advantage but Experts get a dip into one of other archetype’s Talent advantage?Still no. Here’s why. I still think the ability to improve your advancement option without a down side is too powerful (especially for one talent). An expert talent option would make them even, but all four of these talents just become must haves now.
March 13, 2014 at 5:19 pm #258877AnonymousInactiveThey are ‘Training’ Talents though so you prevent yourself from taking others (like Sabbatical)
John
March 13, 2014 at 5:23 pm #258881AnonymousInactiveThey are ‘Training’ Talents though so you prevent yourself from taking others (like Sabbatical)
John
Still too powerful as a single talent with no down side.March 13, 2014 at 5:26 pm #258882AnonymousInactiveI’m of the opinion that most Talents should not have a ‘downside’. You’re already investing a very limited resource into them.
However, what about if CT changed each Archetypes’s skill advancement (Assuming they’d get combined) to:
Arcane (with CT): “You gain 1 Rank in one Arcanum, Deceit, Stealth and 1 Rank in a number of Trained Skills equal to your Passive Logic chosen from any Lore, or any Background Skill. You may skill only gain 1 Rank in any given skill using this advancement”
Divine (with CT): “You gain 1 Rank in one Arcanum, Know (Religion), Deity Skill and 1 Rank in a number of Trained Skills equal to your Passive Logic chosen from any Social, or any Background Skill. You may skill only gain 1 Rank in any given skill using this advancement”
Martial (with CT): “You gain 3 Ranks in any Combat Skill and 1 Rank in a number of Trained Skills equal to your Passive Logic chosen from any Physical, or any Background Skill. You may skill only gain 1 Rank in any given skill using this advancement”
Expert (Talent Advancement with a new CT): “Choose Arcanum, Combat, or Devout when you select this Talent. This choice may not be changed.” Then the Advancement becomes “Gain 1 Skill Talent and 1 Talent chosen from Skill or either Combat, Arcanum, Devout (Which was selected when the talent was taken).
Sure it allows casters to get Combat Skills and Martial to get Arcanum Skills and Experts can get both now. I’m okay with that personally.
John
March 13, 2014 at 5:29 pm #258885AnonymousInactiveI agree most talents should have a downside, but this one talent makes you so much more versatile that I don’t think it’s acceptable.
March 13, 2014 at 5:36 pm #258889AnonymousInactiveI agree most talents should have a downside, but this one talent makes you so much more versatile that I don’t think it’s acceptable.
There are a *few* backgrounds for which this really shines: Initiate of the Gods comes to mind. However, in *many* cases you’re going to overlap 1 background skill with things you can already take anyways (Lore, Social, Combat, Physical categories in particular) that I think you’re concern, while warranted, isn’t as huge an effect as you may think. I may take it as an exercise to look at all the backgrounds and pull out their skills and see how bad it could be.
John
March 13, 2014 at 7:34 pm #258906AnonymousInactiveare we just going on with continued training?
March 13, 2014 at 8:23 pm #258917AnonymousInactiveare we just going on with continued training?
did you ever see the “real” version before it was morphed?
March 13, 2014 at 8:25 pm #258918AnonymousInactivepedro, i have long since deleted those emails but it was at my behest the talent was changed in the first place
March 13, 2014 at 8:34 pm #258924AnonymousInactivein that case
Continued Training [Skill, Training]
Even though you have left your old career behind, you continue to hone your skills.
Requirement: Arcane (a), Divine (a), or Martial (a)
Benefit: Add your Background’s skills to your Archetype’s following skill advancement option:
· Arcane: Gain 1 Rank to a number of trained Lore Skills or any of your Background skills, equal to 3+ your Passive Logic. Arcanum, Deceit, and Stealth may not be chosen from your Background skills.
· Divine: Gain 1 Rank to a number of trained Social skills or any of your Background skills, equal to 3+ your Passive Logic. Arcanum, your Deity’s chosen skill, and Knowledge (Religion) may not be chosen from your Background skills.
· Martial: Gain 1 Rank in a number of trained Combat skills, Physical skills, or any of your Background skills, equal to 3 + your Passive Logic.
Special: If a skill group listed includes a skill selected as one of your Background skills, you may still only gain 1 Rank in that skill during a single character advancement opportunity
March 13, 2014 at 8:37 pm #258928AnonymousInactiveWhy was it changed from this? This seems balanced to me (assuming an Expert version was forthcoming along the way?)
John
- AuthorPosts
- The forum ‘Harvesters Internal’ is closed to new topics and replies.