Shields as Weapons

@Pedro: I would like to say, I would like shield runes to count as both, seeing as double weapon runes count as both sides.

That would be way too powerful to have 1 rune count twice for 2 different types (a defense and offense). Double weapon runes work because it’s still just ‘1 weapon’ and you generally use both sides in your attacks. You are also still limited to the same number of runes on a single weapon (Double weapons don’t get double the rune slots)

Shields also have the best weapon trucks available to them (shield slam I’m looking at you).

John

It would just make shield’s simpler.

Simpler and one of the most powerful weapons in the game if they could treat a single rune as both Weapon and Shield.

John

I agree with John. You’d see people walking around with a shield strapped to each arm. Ooh. Talk about TWF cheese.

Scott

Pathfinder had this for a while (fixed in the 3rd or 4th errata iirc). The way the shield tree feats worked, the best weapons were a pair of shields. Definitely cheesy…

Yeah, this comment thread is pretty ridiculous.

the effect of me having my shield runes count both ways is my avalanche rune would once per something(encounter?) give me an extra d6 of non exploding damage and I would get 1 AR vs cold.

You’d effectively get 2x the rune slots on shields. If that’s not overkill, I don’t know what is.

John

Double weapons would be unbalanced if it allowed different weapons on each end. That would effectively double your rune slots. Having the same rune affect both ends is the balanced way to handle it. They are both weapon runes as well.

John

1) Double weapons are designed to (potentially) be used to hit the target multiple times with the same weapon. As such, the rune is on the Weapon, so every hit would still be with a runed weapon. You are not having multiple runic affects, it is just that the same weapon is being used to hit people multiple times.

2) Shields are not double weapons, so you cannot hit with them multiple times per two-weapon fighting. Similarly, the argument that you should gain BOTH the Shield Benefit AND the Weapon Benefit from the same rune would mean you are LITERALLY gaining two rune benefits, while in the above example with a double weapon, you gain the SAME Rune benefit, you just get a chance to hit people more often with the weapon.

Personally, I feel that Shield Runes are Shield Runes, and that (even though they CAN be used as weapons) they shouldn’t get Weapons Runes at all. However, within the scope of the universe, unless you get an amalgamated rune you CANNOT gain two benefits from the same rune. Otherwise, as stated many times, why would someone use ANY other weapon?

so why is it that much more to have a shield operate as a weapon and as shield runes? its not like your using different runes its just they are doing different things.

The shield is already incredibly useful as it can be used as both. Allowing runes to count double duty as both multiplies their versatility beyond anything else. If there were a rule that allowed you to attune your runes each day as either weapon or shield that would be powerful but manageable.

A weapon rune only has effect when you’re attacking with it. Letting shields have both the attack and passive bonus all the time is double dipping into unbalanced territory.

With double weapons, you are using one weapon. Certainly using the double weapon part is nice perk, but you’re suffering (as shown with calculations) a decrease in effectiveness without a major investment in talents.

John