Weapon Training (Unarmed)?

Matt, I understand the differences of Weapon Training (Unarmed) vs skill in Melee (Unarmed). However, it just seems odd how hard it is in Arcanis to actually become fully “trained” in Unarmed. Gaining the Weapon Training is very limited. Gaining Melee (Unarmed) is more open but still somewhat limited.

Overall, Unarmed is almost as limited as Double Spear which is supposed to be a very rare weapon. This seems very weird.

I don’t know enough about Pankration to really make any useful comment. For comparison to the US, you are much more likely to run into a gun than melee weapon (and vs a gun, any melee weapon (or unarmed) is very likely to lose). More importantly, Arcanis is a fantasy world with orders of warrior monks – yes, at least part of that is because it started based on D&D (they do seem to be downplayed in ARPG).

I understand there isn’t supposed to be a tradition of unarmed combat throughout the known realms, and that is reflected in the lack of unarmed being a region weapon skill. I find this extremely odd, but I accept it. The only place I think there is a disconnect in the rules is in the pirate islands. Unarmed fighting is important enough there that it is one of the base skills available for people from the region – which seems to me to indicate a significant unarmed fighting tradition in the islands, but for some reason unarmed fighting isn’t a weapon proficiency associated with the region. I find that odd.

I don’t entirely see what the fuss is about.

The original question was do characters start out with Weapon Training (Unarmed) for free and the answer is no. People don’t naturally start out with a gift for unarmed combat vis-a-via armed combat. To be dangerous with anything you have put in time and effort.

There is a secondary question/comment that mechanically it seems hard to pick up weapon training and mastery in unarmed combat. I kinda agree with this and personally, if running a home campaign, I might give it to martial archetype characters as a freebie. A lot of basic training from armies to self defense classes teach at hand to hand unarmed fighting. At a guess it’s because the stakes are lower. An accidental hard punch is easier “to fix” than an accidental gun shot or knife stabbing. I disagree somewhat with Cody and his assessment of Legionsirres and unarmed combat. Though I agree as heavy infantry the core of their training was elsewhere, I think if we jumped in a time machine to “do research in the ancient world” that we’d see that you were worse off picking bar fights with Legionaires than with civilians.

Pre-Tukufu I played a Nierite and he feared getting killed in a bar fight because he sucked in melee without a sword in his hand(s). That simultaneously bugged me…and gave me an interesting hook to RP. On the other hand I’ve built a few characters as experiments tha centered on unarmed combat. I did not find it THAT onerous to spend the two talents on weapon training & pugilist.

Final note: No game that I’ve ever played simulates combat perfectly.

I don’t see an issue. Fists are not as effective as knives. It SHOULD take more to make them as effective as a dagger.

Plus, it’s easily gotten around by putting on a gauntlet – which is also a big advantage unarmed has – it has numerous weapons that can all be used, and whose weapon tricks can all be used, off of one base weapon training talent – between the basic unarmed, the gauntlet, and the cestus with just weapon training (unarmed) you can get access to 7 weapon tricks (shielding, grasp the blade, mighty swing, stunning strike, from earth to sky, rapid strike, and hamstring), which is significantly more than any other weapon provides.

Where does it say that you get those free with Weapon Training (Unarmed)? Unless I missed something, each of those is a different weapon requiring its own Weapon Training.