Arcanis: Cradle of Empires KickStarter is now LIVE!

I’m pretty happy with the land grant option as a pledge option (mostly because Countess Roumyana needs an estate from which to enjoy her semi-retirement from the Crusade, yo). And I don’t necessarily think it’s incompatible with an eventual in-game option to own land in exchange for in-game currency, if that’s something the campaign wants to do someday.

[I do hold an unschooled opinion that the value of land in the Arcanis economy would in theory be such that an adventurer could take their spoils and buy a small house or apartment somewhere out of the way. That said, I’ve not been following the discussions about the economy, and that’s an off-the-cuff reaction, not one I can back up. And frankly, a land ownership system is not high on my list of Things The Arcanis Campaign Needs.]

All that said: I’m actually 100% ok with the land grant not having a specific gold value, because I think it’s critical that something that comes as a Kickstarter reward be primarily of story value and NOT be resellable. I think the Kickstarter has done a nice job so far of NOT causing a pay-to-play problem within the campaign — it has opened up otherwise limited character options which are different but not (I hope) more powerful than those available to by-the-book characters, and allowed items with small in-game bonuses/conveniences (+2 to Streetwise plus upkeep costs covered, +2 to certain skills from a Useful Item), without making those items a necessity. If there is a sense of “oh, you should have joined the campaign during the Kickstarter, because it gave you advantages that are game-changing”, I think *that* would be a damaging aftereffect. I haven’t seen that so far, and I’m glad.

Lindsay

Henry, you seem to be blocking something that was potentially in the works for the Shared Campaign (land purchases) and that’s with what I have a problem – the implication of all or nothing.

I completely agree that there is no way PCs could have scraped together enough gold to buy a manor, villa, or farm large enough to be the primary supplier of a small city…especially if the property is in a prime location.

But if you’re suggesting that any property is outside the reach of the PCs’ means, that’s just crazy. Like any other medieval-ish society, there have to be thousands of poor people that own small tracks of land and very modest homes. There have to be ‘middle class’ families that (barely) own their own homes in the lesser districts of the First City, Old Coryan, etc.

James,

Well, if that’s your opinion of what I’m doing, then I suppose I’m guilty of advocating for a “bad practice”.

That’s my point, exactly. Obviously the land grants from Kickstarter should be opulent, huge, awesome… But, in-game, we should be able to buy simple land/homes. Kickstarter should not trump the campaign, it should add to it.

I think that both Kickstarter Property Purchases and In-Game Land Purchases can co-exist together. The Kickstarter Purchases sound like they are definitely ‘grander in scale’ than what would be feasible for characters (If they are truly tens of thousands of gp). The in-game land purchases are probably going to be more affordable and might be available in other places.

Personally, I don’t see a big issue with allowing both side-by-side.

John, I refer you to this quote by Henry:

“The Add On here is representative of inherited homes or granted lands that are far beyond the resources your characters have. I sincerely doubt that anyone has a few hundred thousand Imperials lying around to purchase a villa on the Corvus River.

But you bring up a good point. I suppose that it would be fairer to just not offer land purchases in game.”

I have repeatedly said I understand that there’s no way the PC’s could afford something huge and/or opulent, but it’s within reason that we could buy something much smaller. Henry has repeatedly said PCs do not have the funds to purchase land/homes. Thus far, he has not made a distinction between Kickstarter land and other land.

@James you are very focused on this idea of Heroes being able to buy land. And it seems like your trying to wring out a concession for characters to be able to purchase land. You might have better luck with that particular agenda going through Tony and Joe, but they are probably focused on getting mods out.

I think it’s worth noting that this campaign has been striving to implement everything from the books. and not add any thing additional to that. and while that choice may have drawbacks its the choice that we as players and authors should embrace.

I find it quite a bit easier to work with campaign staff in a spirit of collaboration rather than an adverserial stance.

@James you are very focused on this idea of Heroes being able to buy land. And it seems like your trying to wring out a concession for characters to be able to purchase land. You might have better luck with that particular agenda going through Tony and Joe, but they are probably focused on getting mods out.
Actually, as I understand it, Henry has the final say on matters within the campaign. If he states that there is no way for PCs to purchase land other than the Kickstarter, there is absolutely no way Tony, Melinda, or Joe will be able to counter that decision. They could make every effort to convince him otherwise, but Henry still has the final say.

Additionally, I think it is a DANGEROUS precedent to set whereby a free-to-play, volunteer run campaign can be trumped due to a pay-for-bonus Kickstarter.

I think it’s worth noting that this campaign has been striving to implement everything from the books. and not add any thing additional to that. and while that choice may have drawbacks its the choice that we as players and authors should embrace.
That’s not exactly true… The proposed Lifestyle costs and the Fate Point cap aren’t balance issues (like Continued Training) and neither are in the books but the former has been suggested and the latter implemented.

I find it quite a bit easier to work with campaign staff in a spirit of collaboration rather than an adverserial stance.
Josh I take exception to this. As I pointed out above, Henry is the final say on whatever the campaign wants to do. I started out simply trying to get clarification on a topic which had been a discussion point before the Kickstarter was even mentioned. It seemed to me, and still does, that a pay-for-bonus Kickstarter is trumping something that was on the docket for the campaign staff to address at some point.

Ok,enough bickering! It’s Christmas! Merry Christmas and a happy New Year!

Thanks to Henry and all the PCI staff and volunteers for all you do, it is Very Appreciated!

Just to add my two cents…
None of us can ever make everyone happy. Henry listened to the out pouring of requests and added some ways for these things to happen to the kick starter campaign. While he can’t make everyone happy, he is making every effort to make as many people happy as he can without unbalancing the game. Becoming argumentitive on the forums is not the way to accomplish what you would like to see happen.

James, if you would like to talk about this further, I am open all day Thursday to discuss. Send me a message on FB and we can talk over the phone to make this easier.

Henry, I for one and very proud and happy with the kickstarter and the results it has had thus far. Obviously we have many supporters and you should be proud of the following that has stood up to back up the campaign and the work you have done!

Warm and happy regards to all of you during this holiday season!
Melinda